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Author Topic: How good is Jermaine O'neal - honest opinions  (Read 4148 times)
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« on: November 20, 2007, 04:55:16 pm »
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From Indiana fans that have watched Jermaine O'neal over the last 3 years:  How good is he really?

I don't get to see him play much (I'm in LA).  My take is that maybe his size and playing in the East mask his lack of offense.  I know he's known for injuries too, but is it that bad?  Am I off base?

Thanks
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« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2007, 05:58:19 pm »
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Right now JO is injured, but he's not sitting out, he's fighting through it, so his play is pretty bad, but he's still a premeir forward when healthy. Offensively he's not the same as he used to be, he doesn't take it to the rim very much and settles for a lot more jump shots - guess he's trying to save his body, which is the main reason his fg% is low. When he takes it to the basket though he's unstoppable, cause he can go left as well as right and has sort of a hook/fingerool mixture thing. He's not really a guy who can carry the scoring load though, so he would do well playing with someone like Kobe. The best part about his game, and the most underrated part is his defense. He is one of the best interior defenders in the league, his ability to block shots and rebound is amazing, and he's even better at help defense. He takes a lot of charges too, I wouldn't be surprised if he's taken at least 10 per game a couple of times so far. You're right though - he probably looks better than he is because of how big he is and how athletic he is in a weak big man conference. But his defense and rebounding are top notch across the whole NBA. He def would be better as a secondary scorer so he doesn't have to carry the load - his body is getting pretty old (remember he was once the youngest player to ever play in an NBA game) - but he overall a premier big man. And also his passing skills have really developed, with age he's become much more of a setup man.
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legenderypete
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« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2007, 06:53:30 pm »
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what ive seen the last few years he could actually be startin his decline maybe it the injury mounting up but he effectiveness is slipping, his defence is good but i dont think it is as good as a few years ago like his rebound numbers are down. Maybe his injurys have made him more restricted and less athletic.

He still a top big in the league but i feel he is on the decline but maybe it just injurys and im just speakin in circles so ill shut up
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« Reply #3 on: November 20, 2007, 08:16:53 pm »
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Quote from: "Pacers Fan Forever"
Right now JO is injured, but he's not sitting out, he's fighting through it, so his play is pretty bad, but he's still a premeir forward when healthy. Offensively he's not the same as he used to be, he doesn't take it to the rim very much and settles for a lot more jump shots - guess he's trying to save his body, which is the main reason his fg% is low. When he takes it to the basket though he's unstoppable, cause he can go left as well as right and has sort of a hook/fingerool mixture thing. He's not really a guy who can carry the scoring load though, so he would do well playing with someone like Kobe. The best part about his game, and the most underrated part is his defense. He is one of the best interior defenders in the league, his ability to block shots and rebound is amazing, and he's even better at help defense. He takes a lot of charges too, I wouldn't be surprised if he's taken at least 10 per game a couple of times so far. You're right though - he probably looks better than he is because of how big he is and how athletic he is in a weak big man conference. But his defense and rebounding are top notch across the whole NBA. He def would be better as a secondary scorer so he doesn't have to carry the load - his body is getting pretty old (remember he was once the youngest player to ever play in an NBA game) - but he overall a premier big man. And also his passing skills have really developed, with age he's become much more of a setup man.


Very well said.  With all that, do you hope he stays or is moved?
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« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2007, 10:30:44 pm »
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Quote from: "Lands"
Quote from: "Pacers Fan Forever"
Right now JO is injured, but he's not sitting out, he's fighting through it, so his play is pretty bad, but he's still a premeir forward when healthy. Offensively he's not the same as he used to be, he doesn't take it to the rim very much and settles for a lot more jump shots - guess he's trying to save his body, which is the main reason his fg% is low. When he takes it to the basket though he's unstoppable, cause he can go left as well as right and has sort of a hook/fingerool mixture thing. He's not really a guy who can carry the scoring load though, so he would do well playing with someone like Kobe. The best part about his game, and the most underrated part is his defense. He is one of the best interior defenders in the league, his ability to block shots and rebound is amazing, and he's even better at help defense. He takes a lot of charges too, I wouldn't be surprised if he's taken at least 10 per game a couple of times so far. You're right though - he probably looks better than he is because of how big he is and how athletic he is in a weak big man conference. But his defense and rebounding are top notch across the whole NBA. He def would be better as a secondary scorer so he doesn't have to carry the load - his body is getting pretty old (remember he was once the youngest player to ever play in an NBA game) - but he overall a premier big man. And also his passing skills have really developed, with age he's become much more of a setup man.


Very well said.  With all that, do you hope he stays or is moved?

moved, im ready to move on, it's obvious we aren't going to win anything with him - no fault of his own, just simple facts we've gone downhill since the brawl. I'm tired of being a 35 win team - a team that doesn't make the playoffs but isn't bad enough to get a good pick - pretty much no-mans land. We need some changes, we can't be in between like that. And you have to get worse before you can get better, we've already tried trying to get better by "Getting better" (taking chances (al harrington, peja, mike dunleavy, troy murphy.....) I just want to rebuild the roster around Granger, Williams and Diogu.

Could you imagine a line up of:

pg - derreck rose
sg - danny granger
sf - shawne williams
pf - ike diogu
c - andrew bynum

lol, ok - im fantasizing - but I just want to move on, I think we should just trade JO for the best young talent we can get or draft picks (Especailly for this years loaded class)
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« Reply #5 on: November 20, 2007, 11:05:04 pm »
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I can understand your feeling.  Watching tonight (granted it was only one game) it looks like you have some talent but don't have an identity.   If you're smart, and I'm not sure Bird is (sorry), I think you have enough pieces to move that you could set yourself up well for the future.

If you watched the game, I think we can safely say Bynum won't be leaving the Lakers unless it's for a BIG name.  It's getting harder and harder to say what we need.  We'll see how this trade affects us.  

Good luck to you and take care.
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« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2007, 01:00:04 am »
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pg - derreck rose
sg - danny granger
sf - shawne williams
pf - ike diogu
c - andrew bynum


im down with that line up!
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t-mac357
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« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2007, 03:40:52 am »
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he's all star caliber, maybe even an mvp canidate on a contender, i think he's displaying a vince carter impression by going through the motions on a team he doesn't want to be on, not playing hard and giving his 100%
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JamaicanGigal0w
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« Reply #8 on: November 21, 2007, 11:34:41 am »
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How good is J.O. right now, not good enough for even Bynum and Farmar, or Bynum and Sasha, or even Bynum by himeslf. U Pacers fans could thank Larry Bird b/c ya had ya chance to get Bynum and last night he showed why you guys shouldn't have passed on him to keep J.O

As for him being a top notch defender and rebounder, you missed me on that, he def hasn't shown it lately and there are more than a handful of better defenders in the NBA right now then J.O
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« Reply #9 on: November 21, 2007, 12:30:23 pm »
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most pacers fans in this forum were not "down" with bynum/kwame/farmar/cook for O'neal... before the season.

now, like Gig said... its too late to get Bynum or Farmar.

maybe Bird can convince J.O. that opting out is the best thing for him to do(even though J.O. said he would, Bird should still nudge him)

the money hes making is weighing down on the Pacers franchise and its in the franchises best interest if he just took the big leap off the payroll.  

sad, that they wont get any players in return for him... but they WILL have cap relief.

Bird is barely holding on to that job.  If he can get J.O. outta there, he just might save his own keister.
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Fair enough.
Fair enough..probably the 2nd ugliest season I've ever seen from the Ravens.
Flacco kind of is a bum..Yeah I get that he isn't that good..
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« Reply #10 on: November 21, 2007, 07:49:47 pm »
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Quote from: "JamaicanGigal0w"
How good is J.O. right now, not good enough for even Bynum and Farmar, or Bynum and Sasha, or even Bynum by himeslf.


haha now u have no idea what your talking about.
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« Reply #11 on: November 21, 2007, 08:10:51 pm »
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Wow, lol, these Lakers fans really hate JO, he's not that bad. If he played with Kobe I think he would be better simply because he wouldn't have to carry the scoring load. I could see him putting up 18 ppg 11 rpg and 3 bpg with Kobe, cause he could focus more on simple winning things like defense and rebounding instead of carrying the offense
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« Reply #12 on: November 21, 2007, 09:20:43 pm »
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Quote from: "Pacers Fan Forever"
Quote from: "Lands"
Quote from: "Pacers Fan Forever"
Right now JO is injured, but he's not sitting out, he's fighting through it, so his play is pretty bad, but he's still a premeir forward when healthy. Offensively he's not the same as he used to be, he doesn't take it to the rim very much and settles for a lot more jump shots - guess he's trying to save his body, which is the main reason his fg% is low. When he takes it to the basket though he's unstoppable, cause he can go left as well as right and has sort of a hook/fingerool mixture thing. He's not really a guy who can carry the scoring load though, so he would do well playing with someone like Kobe. The best part about his game, and the most underrated part is his defense. He is one of the best interior defenders in the league, his ability to block shots and rebound is amazing, and he's even better at help defense. He takes a lot of charges too, I wouldn't be surprised if he's taken at least 10 per game a couple of times so far. You're right though - he probably looks better than he is because of how big he is and how athletic he is in a weak big man conference. But his defense and rebounding are top notch across the whole NBA. He def would be better as a secondary scorer so he doesn't have to carry the load - his body is getting pretty old (remember he was once the youngest player to ever play in an NBA game) - but he overall a premier big man. And also his passing skills have really developed, with age he's become much more of a setup man.


Very well said.  With all that, do you hope he stays or is moved?

moved, im ready to move on, it's obvious we aren't going to win anything with him - no fault of his own, just simple facts we've gone downhill since the brawl. I'm tired of being a 35 win team - a team that doesn't make the playoffs but isn't bad enough to get a good pick - pretty much no-mans land. We need some changes, we can't be in between like that. And you have to get worse before you can get better, we've already tried trying to get better by "Getting better" (taking chances (al harrington, peja, mike dunleavy, troy murphy.....) I just want to rebuild the roster around Granger, Williams and Diogu.

Could you imagine a line up of:

pg - derreck rose
sg - danny granger
sf - shawne williams
pf - ike diogu
c - andrew bynum

lol, ok - im fantasizing - but I just want to move on, I think we should just trade JO for the best young talent we can get or draft picks (Especailly for this years loaded class)


first of all JO's fg% has always been low to begin with even during the year he was an mvp candidate.  

but i do like your idea of trading him for young talent and picks.  that line up you got there would be something to build on for the future.  but i have a hard time believing the lakers would get rid of bynum now with the way he's playing, especially for JO.  they should've pulled the trigger when they had the chance.
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UNIT
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« Reply #13 on: November 22, 2007, 12:46:05 am »
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jermaine plays 26min or less (5-0)
10/31 - PACERS 119 WIZARDS 110
11/2 - PACERS 87 HEAT 85
11/3 - PACERS 121 GRIZZLIES 111
11/17 - PACERS 117 JAZZ 97
11/21 - PACERS 103 HORNETS 93


jermaine plays 27min or more (0-7)
11/7 - CLIPPERS 104 PACERS 89
11/9 - BOBCATS 96 PACERS 87
11/10 - NUGGETS 113 PACERS 106
11/13 - CELTICS 101 PACERS 86
11/14 - WIZARDS 103 PACERS 90
11/16 - RAPTORS 110 PACERS 101
11/20 - LAKERS 134 PACERS 114
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olsons3
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« Reply #14 on: November 22, 2007, 12:52:42 am »
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To the Laker Fans...  I was in favor of the trade before the season.

The system he was in last year fit him well, but the other players didn't fit, so he was being double-teamed getting off the team bus.  Now we have a new coach and a new system, that seems to operate well without him.

Now he had off season surgery, followed by a knee-on-knee collision in camp with Shawne Williams, and his leg strength and conditioning are obviously not up to what he expects.  They sat him tonight against the Hornets, which was the right move.  Last year he was able to play through the knee injury because the rigid half court offense didn't wear it down during the game.  This years style is way more up tempo and the weakness in the recovering leg is showing.

I think once he has been allowed to recover fully he will play better.  I don't think this system works to make him a scoring leader, and the triangle would be far better.  You put him on the floor with Kobe, and he's good for 25 a night.  In the Pacers current offense, he will get much less.

Defensively, when healthy, he can block shots and take charges with equal ability.  When you come in hard you can leave with either a personal foul or a Spaulding tatoo on your forehead.  With his knee still recovering he has no "hops" so he has done what he can.
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