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Author Topic: Who would you want as coach?  (Read 18131 times)
shangrila
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« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2009, 01:49:25 am »
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KG, Rondo and Perkins all play above average man-to-man defense.  KG obviously a lot better than both but Rondo is a great on the ball defender.  He also plays bigger than he is.
I'd say Perkins is about average. He's a big centre that can hold his own in the post but I'm not confident in his ability to guard pick and rolls.

And this isn't just about the starting lineup. Glen Davis, Leon Powe, Gabe Pruitt and Eddie House are all average or below average defenders that work within the defensive system they have.

when you have guys like randy foye, telfair, miller, love, jefferson, gomes, e.t.c.(who are undersized and not committed to defense) defense isn't really going to help them play to their potential, it would be alot more beneficial to those guys to get a coach who could evolve their games offensively, its not like they'll contend, but at least they'll be competitive and start looking toward making the playoffs
That part is wrong. It's not that they don't try it's that the majority of them have bad physical tools. Foye is a decent defender at point guard and can step up occasionally against shooting guards. Love and Jefferson don't have any trouble guarding other bigs but when Love hits about 6-10/11 he'll be moved to centre to guard the slower players. Gomes and Miller are too slow and Telfair is too small. None of this has anything to do with not being committed to defence.

But my other point was that we don't need an offensive minded coach to succeed offensively. We were playing well after McHale took over and simplified the offence and so any simple offence will probably work with us. I mean all you have to do is dump the ball to Al/Love and then have everyone run around until someone has an open shot.

And then you have to consider Wittman. He ran alot of plays and that kind of a coach didn't fit with us here.

BTW I am thinking about contending in the future. I can see your angle of loading up on offence and just making the playoffs but if we keep getting swept we'll just be the second coming of the Gasol Grizzlies. And as a fan that's the last thing I want to see.

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t-mac357
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« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2009, 01:09:00 pm »
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size is hardly the problem with you guy's post defense, both al and love are poor man defenders in the post, they just don't focus their energy on defense, and that's not likely to change if they stay on the court together for large periods of time during the game

foye is not capable of defending the best 2 guards in the nba at a decent level, not just because he's only 6'4 either, defense just isn't his bread and butter, same with telfair

when picking a coach, i'd say go with a guy who'd maximize the talent currently on the roster, and that's just what saunders would do, they might get into contention eventually, but they need to start with aiming for the playoffs
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shangrila
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« Reply #17 on: February 28, 2009, 07:19:58 pm »
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It's not that they don't try it's just that most of our players don't have the physical tools to be dominant defenders.

I never said Foye could guard shooting guards but he does a decent job on point guards and depending on the matchups he does ok against some shooting guards. We all know he can't stop players like Kobe or Wade but not many players can.

I don't know how much Timberwolves games you watch but Kevin Love is a strong post defender. He gets in trouble when he has to defend the perimeter forwards in the league but when someone is trying to post him up he does well for a rookie big.

You seem to be saying that nobody on this team tries to play defence which just isn't true. I'm not saying anyone on this roster is a good defender but there is a big difference between trying but not being big/quick enough and not trying at all.
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t-mac357
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« Reply #18 on: February 28, 2009, 10:28:58 pm »
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any way you skin it this isn't even an average defensive team, with that said, it doesn't make much sense to try to force an identity change on a team by hiring a coach that won't maximize their abilities

their strength is offense and with that said i'd hire an offensive minded coach to get them to the next level
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shangrila
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« Reply #19 on: March 01, 2009, 03:05:51 am »
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And then what? We make the playoffs and get knocked out every year because we don't play defence. Our coach doesn't teach it and so our players stop trying because their coach doesn't care. Getting to the playoffs would be nice but I'd rather start trying to preach defence as Al's still developing and about to hit his prime then try and do it in 3 years time when everyone realises we took the short road in trying to make the playoffs.
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t-mac357
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« Reply #20 on: March 01, 2009, 04:45:39 am »
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al jefferson isn't going to get minny to contention, did you forget what garnett dealt with for a decade? struggling to get out of the first round, and he's way better than jefferson perhaps will ever be, and he had pretty solid defensive teams

i agree it takes defense to win championships but not every championship team is a defensive powerhouse, as long as you play solid defense you have a shot, but you should stick to the bread and butter of your personnel, and with this group that's the offensive side of the ball

your talking about pursuing a goal that perhaps you'll never get to, some players will never be great defenders, especially if they carry an extremely large offensive load like jefferson, its almost unrealistic to expect to evolve jefferson into an above average defender due to some coaching

the main goal for a rebuilding team is getting a coach who can maximize results with the product on the floor

it makes no sense to bring in a championship mindset to a team that has no shot at even competing for it, other than jefferson, none of the other minny players would crack a contending starting lineup, with that in mind you have to approach the growth of the team accordingly
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shangrila
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« Reply #21 on: March 01, 2009, 06:30:52 am »
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It's obvious we're not going to agree on this. The only problem I have with your post is that last paragraph, about growth. You make it sound like just because we don't have players that would be good starters on good teams we should basically throw in the towel and just run with what we have. Rebuilding teams are about building towards something. Oklahoma City might suck now but when they're ready to make the playoffs that defensive mindset they're developing will be very valuable. THAT'S what I want on this team. So that when we're ready to make the playoffs we can atleast compete with the best teams in a playoff series. 
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cselby
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« Reply #22 on: March 01, 2009, 09:32:29 am »
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T-mac I have to say you're being a little hard on Minnesota here, they've got some nice pieces on the team. They aren't any worse off than any of the other lottery teams in the league.
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t-mac357
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« Reply #23 on: March 01, 2009, 02:41:05 pm »
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to sum it all up, i just don't see a point in building to win championships when your a lottery team, i think every team should take babysteps and the mindset of building to get a .500 record, building to make the playoffs, building to win in the playoffs, then building to contend in an order similar to that, otherwise its just striving after the wind
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Dice Dice Baby!!
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« Reply #24 on: March 01, 2009, 03:48:03 pm »
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Mario Elie.
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shangrila
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« Reply #25 on: March 01, 2009, 09:59:21 pm »
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If you're not building to win a championship then what are you building towards?

But I think you're confused by what I'm saying. I'm not talking about contending next season. What I want is to create a culture that will benefit us in the future when we're ready to contend. Trying to go from high lottery team to contender is almost impossible, unless you're lucky like Boston.
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t-mac357
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« Reply #26 on: March 02, 2009, 01:23:28 am »
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If you're not building to win a championship then what are you building towards?

But I think you're confused by what I'm saying. I'm not talking about contending next season. What I want is to create a culture that will benefit us in the future when we're ready to contend. Trying to go from high lottery team to contender is almost impossible, unless you're lucky like Boston.

boston has an appealing market though, minnesota doesn't, there aren't nba players hoping to someday play with the t-wolves or al jefferson, and that's a problem for them

every so often a small market team gets blessed with a lebron james type player that puts the franchise on the map, kind of like what garnett did over a decade ago, other than that minny isn't an appealing destination to many
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shangrila
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« Reply #27 on: March 02, 2009, 02:14:40 am »
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I didn't say anything about free agents and I know that we have to build through the draft and through trades more then free agency. I'm talking about developing a defensive culture for the future. That's all.
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czaras
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« Reply #28 on: March 02, 2009, 07:52:44 am »
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With McHale as coach and a healthy Al Jefferson we are a 30+ win team. It doesn't take much to be pushed into the playoff race because both Dallas and Phoenix are aging teams.

Foye is a bad defender. And way you cut it, he gets blown by not only by Chris Paul but also by all the Will Solomon's of this league. Sad but true. Al Jefferson doesn't show much interest in defending, sadly.

Kevin Love is the only guy I see improving as a defender because you obviously can see - he WANTS to improve that area. He still gets owned by 6'11 and taller guys (like JO, LMA... I'm not even talking about D12, Yao, Shaq) just because they shoot over him. But he's a smart player and has a big body, he might improve and bang them up enough to make scoring on him tougher.

Telfair is an ok defender, just he's small. He compensates that with his speed. Ryan Gomes is a decent defender. So is Corey Brewer, just Corey is faster and has lockdown potential. Carney is a good defender too.

Having all of that in mind; you cannot make a great defensive team without an anchor in the middle (KG, Duncan). But you can teach a team to at least be 'decent' defensively if you have 2-3 guys who can play good D and the rest is TRYING. That's the problem with the Wolves. Our two best performers on offense (Big Al, Foye) have close to no interest in defence, despite yammering about it after every loss. That's the example they're setting, sadly.

As for building for the future - I hope this coming draft will be the last of the infamous 'youth movement'. Get James Harden, Hasheem Thabeet, Jrue Holiday, Tyreke Evans, Nick Calathes... anyone we will be capable of picking up at #6 and #17 for all I care. And TRADE FOR SOME PROVEN PLAYERS. G-Force... Tyson Chandler...Kirk Hinrich... they're right there, for the right package. Next season Cardinal will be a 6mill expiring, Miller a 10mill expiring and everyone is committed to the 2010 frenzy (which is nonsense, btw). USE thos eteam to obtain solid players on long-term deals. That way we do not have to worry that someone will look to resign with Miami or NYK instead of us.

If we get Thabeet in the draft, look at Hinrich to run our team or at G-Force to help our D. If we get James Harden or Jrue Holiday - try to pry Tyson Chandler away. There are lots of very good unwanted players on long term deals the Wolves should look at. Next season is shopping time.

Assuming Randy Foye can be a capable starter at SG for us (doubt it, I see him in a 6th man role eventually since he can play both guard spots), we've only got SG and PF covered up. If we are able to plug a guy from the draft at C (Thabeet) or at PG (Holiday, Jennings... even Calathes) the rest of positions should be filled up via tardes.

And this time, do not look at the offensive performance. Mike Miller is a very good all around player, but he's a poor defender. We don't need a stopper, we need someone to set an example on defense. Hinrich, Chandler, G-Force all fit the bill.
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t-mac357
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« Reply #29 on: March 03, 2009, 12:18:20 am »
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you cannot make a great defensive team without an anchor in the middle (KG, Duncan). But you can teach a team to at least be 'decent' defensively if you have 2-3 guys who can play good D and the rest is TRYING. That's the problem with the Wolves. Our two best performers on offense (Big Al, Foye) have close to no interest in defence, despite yammering about it after every loss. That's the example they're setting, sadly.

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this is exactly why it doesn't make sense to me to try to develop a defensive culture, saunders isn't a horrible defensive coach, he just focuses on offense, and with this personnel, that's perfect
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