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Author Topic: So Miami wants Bosh...  (Read 17265 times)
LordLeoshes
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2nd Amendment wont b needed til they try taking it


« Reply #75 on: February 09, 2010, 09:55:42 pm »

Beasley, Wade, Cook, James Jones and Chalmers are the only guys staying.  That leaves them 30M to fill out the team.  I personally would get Boozer over Haslen or just move Beasley to PF.  If you resign anyone -it should be J Oneil.

Since DWade is going to take around 16-18M off the cap that leaves you with 12 million.   Which meas at most you get one decent player - or sign a bunch of fillers -Nate/Haslem and ONeil.  How this makes Miami better than :

Bosh/Barngs/Hedo/Calderon/Jack/Evans and De Rozan -are quite an under-rated team imo.
You are talking about a front line that averages close to 20 pts/8.5 rebounds (42 points/17 rebounds) and a back court (Calderon/Jack/De Rozan/ Weems) -that gives you at least 30 points.  They can score at least 72 points a game if they hit their averages.  Throw in a ok game from Evans and Turk -and you get 16 pts/10 rebounds = 88 pts a game!!.

Beasley + ONeil -will give you 30 points and 15 rebounds at most.  DWade say 30 points and the rest of the team Haslem/Cook/Jones -another 20 points.  So they can score 80 points at most.  Beasley is getting better but he will never be the presence in the post that Boozer and others continue to be.  If they get Stoudemire -this works out a bit.

They have Stoudemire/ONeil/Beasley/Wade/Chalmers = 20+10+15+25+10= 80 points a game!! Throw in the rest of the team for 20 points = 100 points a game.  But they will be over tha cap for sure.  Thats why -in some ways -it makes more sense for Dwade to leave the team than it does for Bosh to leave.




Just want to add that Anthony has a player option.
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LordLeoshes
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2nd Amendment wont b needed til they try taking it


« Reply #76 on: February 09, 2010, 10:00:12 pm »

I think Miami's No. 1 plan is to get Wade and Bosh/LBJ on the same team, re-sign Haslem, draft well, and fill out the rest of the roster cheaply.  Then getting that final piece of the puzzle in 2010-2011 when they have a MLE.

I think Miami's No. 2 plan is to sign 2nd-tier FAs.  They'll have over $20M of cap room after re-signing Wade.  The complicated math I posted before.  I think they re-sign Haslem (as 6th man), O'Neal, and maybe even Q-Rich.  And then they go after Boozer, who would make perfect sense for this team (unlike OKC, where you keep pushing him).  They aren't going after Stoudemire - he doesn't fit their system and he needs a Nash-level PG to be effective (which is why he stays in AZ, I think).  With Haslem, O'Neal, and Boozer as their three main bigs (along with probably a rookie or vet minimum C), they'd have the best frontcourt in the East.  They then either draft or sign a decent PG.

I think Miami's No. 3 plan (i.e. Wade leaves) is to get good, decently priced FAs, to draft well, and to rebuild the team that way.  I don't think Wade leaves, so this is probably moot.

I'll agree to disagree with you about Toronto.  They have some decent to good players.  But they are, almost to a man, overpaid for their production.  They also don't have answers for guys like Howard, KG, and even Shaq in the playoffs.  I think they're a 25-30 win team without Bosh.  Same as Cleveland without LBJ.  Both teams have gone all out to keep their superstars with them.  If Bosh or LBJ leaves, it would be catastrophic.  





In #2 you forgot to mention a trade of Beasley for (either) a SF/C/PG, or combination.

& #3 is use our cap, & picks in trade to teams looking to get under the cap in the summer if Pat cant get that other max player to go along with Wade.
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Every tyrant in the 20th century began his tyranny by first confiscating guns, & gold from the people over whom he ruled over.

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LordLeoshes
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2nd Amendment wont b needed til they try taking it


« Reply #77 on: February 09, 2010, 10:02:07 pm »

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And I'd take Haslem over Bargnani any day.  Less points but a better rebounder and much better defender.

Although you made no relavent points, this one shows how much of a foolish homer you are.


Why? He did say Bargs was a better scorer, while Haslem was the better defender, & rebounder, & it true.
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Every tyrant in the 20th century began his tyranny by first confiscating guns, & gold from the people over whom he ruled over.

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LordLeoshes
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2nd Amendment wont b needed til they try taking it


« Reply #78 on: February 09, 2010, 10:04:14 pm »

I think Miami's No. 1 plan is to get Wade and Bosh/LBJ on the same team, re-sign Haslem, draft well, and fill out the rest of the roster cheaply.  Then getting that final piece of the puzzle in 2010-2011 when they have a MLE.

I think Miami's No. 2 plan is to sign 2nd-tier FAs.  They'll have over $20M of cap room after re-signing Wade.  The complicated math I posted before.  I think they re-sign Haslem (as 6th man), O'Neal, and maybe even Q-Rich.  And then they go after Boozer, who would make perfect sense for this team (unlike OKC, where you keep pushing him).  They aren't going after Stoudemire - he doesn't fit their system and he needs a Nash-level PG to be effective (which is why he stays in AZ, I think).  With Haslem, O'Neal, and Boozer as their three main bigs (along with probably a rookie or vet minimum C), they'd have the best frontcourt in the East.  They then either draft or sign a decent PG.

I think Miami's No. 3 plan (i.e. Wade leaves) is to get good, decently priced FAs, to draft well, and to rebuild the team that way.  I don't think Wade leaves, so this is probably moot.

I'll agree to disagree with you about Toronto.  They have some decent to good players.  But they are, almost to a man, overpaid for their production.  They also don't have answers for guys like Howard, KG, and even Shaq in the playoffs.  I think they're a 25-30 win team without Bosh.  Same as Cleveland without LBJ.  Both teams have gone all out to keep their superstars with them.  If Bosh or LBJ leaves, it would be catastrophic.  
The loss of Wade is what would be catastrophic, Toronto would still be borderline playoffs and Cleveland still has talent on their roster. Miami has nothing. 


Except for over $40million to get whoever the hell Pat wants. UH DUH.  Roll Eyes

what would TOR, & CLV have ?
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Every tyrant in the 20th century began his tyranny by first confiscating guns, & gold from the people over whom he ruled over.

 Hitler, Chaves, Castro, Quadafi, Stalin, Idi Amin, Ma Tse-tung, pol pot, & Kim Jong-il would all agree that gun control works!
ballers101
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« Reply #79 on: February 09, 2010, 10:52:17 pm »

I think Miami's No. 1 plan is to get Wade and Bosh/LBJ on the same team, re-sign Haslem, draft well, and fill out the rest of the roster cheaply.  Then getting that final piece of the puzzle in 2010-2011 when they have a MLE.

I think Miami's No. 2 plan is to sign 2nd-tier FAs.  They'll have over $20M of cap room after re-signing Wade.  The complicated math I posted before.  I think they re-sign Haslem (as 6th man), O'Neal, and maybe even Q-Rich.  And then they go after Boozer, who would make perfect sense for this team (unlike OKC, where you keep pushing him).  They aren't going after Stoudemire - he doesn't fit their system and he needs a Nash-level PG to be effective (which is why he stays in AZ, I think).  With Haslem, O'Neal, and Boozer as their three main bigs (along with probably a rookie or vet minimum C), they'd have the best frontcourt in the East.  They then either draft or sign a decent PG.

I think Miami's No. 3 plan (i.e. Wade leaves) is to get good, decently priced FAs, to draft well, and to rebuild the team that way.  I don't think Wade leaves, so this is probably moot.

I'll agree to disagree with you about Toronto.  They have some decent to good players.  But they are, almost to a man, overpaid for their production.  They also don't have answers for guys like Howard, KG, and even Shaq in the playoffs.  I think they're a 25-30 win team without Bosh.  Same as Cleveland without LBJ.  Both teams have gone all out to keep their superstars with them.  If Bosh or LBJ leaves, it would be catastrophic.  
The loss of Wade is what would be catastrophic, Toronto would still be borderline playoffs and Cleveland still has talent on their roster. Miami has nothing. 


Except for over $40million to get whoever the hell Pat wants. UH DUH.  Roll Eyes

what would TOR, & CLV have ?
Cleveland not so much, but Toronto still has quite a bit of talent....
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ballers101
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« Reply #80 on: February 09, 2010, 10:54:04 pm »

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And I'd take Haslem over Bargnani any day.  Less points but a better rebounder and much better defender.

Although you made no relavent points, this one shows how much of a foolish homer you are.


Why? He did say Bargs was a better scorer, while Haslem was the better defender, & rebounder, & it true.
So you would take Bargnani over Haslem because of marginally better defense and marginally better rebounding? Fine then I would take Bowen over Kobe because he is a much better defender. It is about the whole package and Haslem vs Bargnani is not even close.
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Miami's Finest
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« Reply #81 on: February 09, 2010, 11:09:16 pm »

Quote
And I'd take Haslem over Bargnani any day.  Less points but a better rebounder and much better defender.

Although you made no relavent points, this one shows how much of a foolish homer you are.


Why? He did say Bargs was a better scorer, while Haslem was the better defender, & rebounder, & it true.
So you would take Bargnani over Haslem because of marginally better defense and marginally better rebounding? Fine then I would take Bowen over Kobe because he is a much better defender. It is about the whole package and Haslem vs Bargnani is not even close.
lol @ Haslem being marginally better on D and at rebouding. He is much better at both of those things, as is Bargs on offense, much better then haslem on O.
There is no need to get homerish.
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ballers101
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« Reply #82 on: February 09, 2010, 11:13:10 pm »

Quote
And I'd take Haslem over Bargnani any day.  Less points but a better rebounder and much better defender.

Although you made no relavent points, this one shows how much of a foolish homer you are.


Why? He did say Bargs was a better scorer, while Haslem was the better defender, & rebounder, & it true.
So you would take Bargnani over Haslem because of marginally better defense and marginally better rebounding? Fine then I would take Bowen over Kobe because he is a much better defender. It is about the whole package and Haslem vs Bargnani is not even close.
lol @ Haslem being marginally better on D and at rebouding. He is much better at both of those things, as is Bargs on offense, much better then haslem on O.
There is no need to get homerish.
Haslem 7.2 RPG in 28 mins with no big rebounding threat like Bosh grabbing boards as O'neal grabs 7 as well. Andrea in 34 mins 6.2 rebounds. Yes Bargnani plays more, but Bosh grabs a lot more rebounds than O'neal does so it takes away from his numbers. Haslem is better yes, but not as much as you make it to be.

Haslem is the better defender no doubt, but Bargnani is a lot better than many of you think and averages 1.4 blocks per game. His man to man defense is actually some of the best, his help defense needs work.
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Miami's Finest
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« Reply #83 on: February 09, 2010, 11:30:04 pm »

Quote
And I'd take Haslem over Bargnani any day.  Less points but a better rebounder and much better defender.

Although you made no relavent points, this one shows how much of a foolish homer you are.


Why? He did say Bargs was a better scorer, while Haslem was the better defender, & rebounder, & it true.
So you would take Bargnani over Haslem because of marginally better defense and marginally better rebounding? Fine then I would take Bowen over Kobe because he is a much better defender. It is about the whole package and Haslem vs Bargnani is not even close.
lol @ Haslem being marginally better on D and at rebouding. He is much better at both of those things, as is Bargs on offense, much better then haslem on O.
There is no need to get homerish.
Haslem 7.2 RPG in 28 mins with no big rebounding threat like Bosh grabbing boards as O'neal grabs 7 as well. Andrea in 34 mins 6.2 rebounds. Yes Bargnani plays more, but Bosh grabs a lot more rebounds than O'neal does so it takes away from his numbers. Haslem is better yes, but not as much as you make it to be.

Haslem is the better defender no doubt, but Bargnani is a lot better than many of you think and averages 1.4 blocks per game. His man to man defense is actually some of the best, his help defense needs work.
Miami is more of a bunch of team rebounders, there is no real standout....
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Miami's Finest
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« Reply #84 on: February 09, 2010, 11:31:59 pm »

I just searched it Miami is marginly better at rebounding then Toronto, so i think that makes your thing about Toronto having Bosh to rebound irrelevant.
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dahurt83
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« Reply #85 on: February 09, 2010, 11:33:10 pm »

I bet you all GM's would take Bargs over Haslem any day.  He stretches out the D and , he's young and growing still. The guy is like what 23?  
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Jack Dempsey
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« Reply #86 on: February 10, 2010, 12:23:21 pm »

how do you feel now about this trade after the latest rumor? expiring + beasley + pick for amare?
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AirForceNone
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« Reply #87 on: February 10, 2010, 01:22:30 pm »

You also forgot the part where we give up Calderon and Turk and also that Bosh is considered the franchise player while also playing better then Amare this year.  So long story short you are not as smart as you thought.....and it's still stupid.
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Jack Dempsey
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« Reply #88 on: February 10, 2010, 01:46:25 pm »

turkoglu and calderon are two good players but both of them aren't the youngest anymore while having long term contracts. they could easily turn into "kenny thomas and SAR"-kind of nightmares in a one or two seasons. two veteran backups but definitely not starters getting $20mill per year.
if bosh leaves you can compare yourself to the this years detroit pistons. a bunch of overpaid vets who can't get it done. why not play it save and take the prospect and the huge expiring and build around derozan, beasley and bargnani (if not traded).
miami on the other hand has to swallow two bad contracts but gets their second superstar and will be able to keep their own role players in the offseason.

i don't say this trade will happen but it's the safest move for both teams. and btw, there were some raptors fans who wrote somewhere on this forum (or realgm, not sure) that toronto somehow has to trade hedo and jose for expirings at least. so i wouldn't consider them as players with much trade value.
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ballers101
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« Reply #89 on: February 10, 2010, 04:12:45 pm »

turkoglu and calderon are two good players but both of them aren't the youngest anymore while having long term contracts. they could easily turn into "kenny thomas and SAR"-kind of nightmares in a one or two seasons. two veteran backups but definitely not starters getting $20mill per year.
if bosh leaves you can compare yourself to the this years detroit pistons. a bunch of overpaid vets who can't get it done. why not play it save and take the prospect and the huge expiring and build around derozan, beasley and bargnani (if not traded).
miami on the other hand has to swallow two bad contracts but gets their second superstar and will be able to keep their own role players in the offseason.

i don't say this trade will happen but it's the safest move for both teams. and btw, there were some raptors fans who wrote somewhere on this forum (or realgm, not sure) that toronto somehow has to trade hedo and jose for expirings at least. so i wouldn't consider them as players with much trade value.
The safest move would be not moving at all. Keeping Bosh is better than having Beasley and trading away vets like Calderon and Turk for nothing? They can still play the game. I have said it so many times Turk is overpaid, but he can still play the damn game. His numbers are literally the same as last year except for points because this team has so many scorers, and he now FINALLY is starting to fit in our system. Just cause your not worth your contract, doesn't mean your not valuable as a player.
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