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Author Topic: Simmons trade suggestion  (Read 6225 times)
94by50
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« on: May 14, 2007, 07:23:20 pm »

I have no idea if this would actually work or not, but the thought of this collaboration actually happening nearly made me pass out.  You mean KG escapes lottery prison AND I get to see him play (with a real team) 82 times a year for free?  Hell yes.

Quote from: "Bill Simmons"
If Phoenix gets bounced this week, don't they HAVE to trade Amare Stoudemire for KG?

Right now, Stoudemire is a base-year compensation player because he's finishing the first year of his contract extension (five years, $73 million). The deal I'm proposing can't work under the cap until mid-July, when Stoudemire's cap figure morphs into the value of his current contract ($13.2 million for next season) and makes him infinitely more easy to trade (for details, check out Larry Coon's NBA Salary Cap FAQ). But they could still agree on a pre-draft trade that wouldn't become official until a few weeks later.

Assuming Atlanta's pick doesn't land in the top-3, here's my proposal: Stoudemire, Atlanta's pick (depending on how the lottery shakes out, it would be as high as fourth or as low as sixth) and Marcus Banks (for cap purposes) to Minnesota for Garnett and Minnesota's pick (as high as seventh, as low as ninth).

Here's why both teams should do it:

Minnesota: That's practically 100 cents on the dollar for KG. They're getting a 1st-team All-NBA big man who's younger than KG, plus they're jumping into the top five of the draft with a chance to add another blue-chip forward (either Brandan Wright or Al Horford). Examine the T-Wolves roster and you'll notice that they don't need a 4-for-1 deal for KG; they're looking at an immediate future in which the Clippers and Celtics own two of their future first-rounders within the next five years, so it wouldn't make sense for them to bottom out with picks and young players. Stoudemire is the best and most sensible option for them. Period.

Phoenix: KG solves four problems for the Suns. First, they don't have to worry about the debilitating Marion/Stoudemire alpha dog battle anymore. Second, they don't have to worry about Stoudemire's surgically reconstructed knee anymore. Third, between KG, Nash and Bell, the Suns would have more than enough toughness/intensity/competitiveness to compete every spring (a real issue for them, even this season -- they're just not nasty enough). And fourth, they'd finally have someone who could potentially play Duncan to a draw (or as close as possible). Stoudemire just isn't a good defensive player -- he's prone to foul trouble and gets discouraged easily (as we witnessed while he pouted on the bench in Game 3). As for the age difference between KG and Stoudemire ... do you realize that Amare is only six years younger than KG? Crazy but true. And slipping two to four spots in the draft wouldn't hurt the Suns because they could still take Joakim Noah, an athletic big man who's perfect for them (and could play right away).

Now ...

Let's say the Suns make this deal, package their other two No. 1 picks (No. 24 and No. 29) to move into the mid-teens for Acie Law IV (the most NBA-ready point guard in the draft), then spend their free agent exemption on an athletic swingman like Matt Barnes. Maybe they'd be paying the luxury tax, but screw it -- how many times can you put together a potential 70-win team that's a prohibitive title favorite and the top TV draw in the league?

Check out this nine-man nucleus: KG, Marion, Bell, Barbosa and Nash as the starters, with Noah, Diaw, Law and Barnes coming off the bench. They'd be covered for every conceivable situation (smallball, grind-it-out ball, run-and-gun, you name it) and they'd be led by two desperate superstars (KG and Nash) who'd basically be ready to give 10 years of their lives to win one title.

Would you bet against that team in the 2008 playoffs? Me neither.

Me neither.
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Josh
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« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2007, 09:27:13 pm »

at first, I didn't like the idea, because trading a guy just entering his prime for a guy just exiting his never seems sound.  But KG's still got some tread on the tires, and it's not like he's going to fall apart before Nash's back does.    Also, it would probably put Diaw back on track, since KG doesn't have to be down low to be effective, and the threat of him getting near the hoop would open up some room for Diaw down low.

I don't know that you need to include the pick, though.  Stoudamire and Banks (who played well for the wolves, and has a reasonable contract) would be enough.  Getting Acie Law would really help the spurs, too.
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Pervis Ellison
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« Reply #2 on: May 14, 2007, 10:51:14 pm »

hard to imagine it happening
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« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2007, 10:58:17 pm »

Quote from: "kingdumcome"
hard to imagine it happening
from the suns standpoint, it'd be hard to pull the trigger, totally.  But I think that makes them favorites to win the title, no question.
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Pervis Ellison
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« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2007, 11:03:51 pm »

KG wont be helpful in a running team at age 31
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« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2007, 11:08:01 pm »

Quote from: "kingdumcome"
KG wont be helpful in a running team at age 31
okay, I'm a touch sick of this sort of statement.  good defensive rebounders are always helpful to running teams.  you don't have to be a wind sprinter to help on a running team.  a rebound plus an outlet pass are just as useful.  KG's a great passer.  he could totally help the team.


edit- lets remember here, that the Lakers were a running team with a Kareem that was nearing 40.  there's more to being a running team than just going up and down the floor fast.
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94by50
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« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2007, 11:17:12 pm »

Anything that keeps them from having to be just a running team should help.  The sooner they're able to play effectively whether they're on the break or in a half-court set, the better off they'll be.
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bobcatsTRUTH
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« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2007, 11:35:23 pm »

would be a great trade for minnesota...
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« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2007, 12:03:25 am »

Quote from: "bobcatsTRUTH"
would be a great trade for minnesota...


yeh very good, i would love to see it happen
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UNIT
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« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2007, 01:26:23 am »

as much as suns want to win now, amare is there future and i think theyll win this yr with him, so no point.
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Happiness1982
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« Reply #10 on: May 15, 2007, 01:38:15 am »

thats a misnomer imo. Nasty runs that team and without him they're never championship material. The shakedown here is whether you commit to the short term goal of a ring or you want a few more years with a good unit that mihgt not be finals material. The Heat Conundrum if you will.

imo Stat+Banks+Pick for KG is appropriate.

KGs clock is at roughly the same time as Nash's and he'd surely take them over the top to at least the finals.
If they dont and the west stays stong until Nash retires or slows down (which is likely to be in 2/3 years) then they're left with stat, an expensive marion and Blur running the point, which certainly isnt a bad little group but like i say, do you want a chance to win it all?
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Pervis Ellison
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« Reply #11 on: May 15, 2007, 07:22:33 am »

Quote from: "Josh"
Quote from: "kingdumcome"
KG wont be helpful in a running team at age 31
okay, I'm a touch sick of this sort of statement.  good defensive rebounders are always helpful to running teams.  you don't have to be a wind sprinter to help on a running team.  a rebound plus an outlet pass are just as useful.  KG's a great passer.  he could totally help the team.


edit- lets remember here, that the Lakers were a running team with a Kareem that was nearing 40.  there's more to being a running team than just going up and down the floor fast.



garnett is also a superstar player who needs to get his share and the whole team to play through him. and he plays in the post and that will slow them down
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« Reply #12 on: May 15, 2007, 08:01:45 am »

Quote from: "kingdumcome"
Quote from: "Josh"
Quote from: "kingdumcome"
KG wont be helpful in a running team at age 31
okay, I'm a touch sick of this sort of statement.  good defensive rebounders are always helpful to running teams.  you don't have to be a wind sprinter to help on a running team.  a rebound plus an outlet pass are just as useful.  KG's a great passer.  he could totally help the team.


edit- lets remember here, that the Lakers were a running team with a Kareem that was nearing 40.  there's more to being a running team than just going up and down the floor fast.



garnett is also a superstar player who needs to get his share and the whole team to play through him. and he plays in the post and that will slow them down


Kingdum, actually read what I'm posting, ok?  you can have a fast break team built around big men.  The two most successful fast breaking teams in the history of the league had two of the most acclaimed big men ever.  Bill Russell jump started the fast break with his defensive play, something Garnett could do to a lesser degree.   funneling blocks to teammates, making good outlet passes to runners.  The Lakers ran, despite Kareem nearing 40 years old!  40!  You need three players going to really run a fast break.  the suns would have four who aren't KG.  

Second, one of the things some people chide Garnett for is his selfless play, that he needs to insist he take more shots, since his tend to be quality ones.  Garnett doesn't force it up, he passes out of double teams religiously.  On a team like the Wolves, it's a bit of a flaw, since the onus is pretty much on him to make the team worthwhile.  On a team like the suns, with great outside shooting and at least one other guy next to him who can go to work down low, it would be a big help.

Also, look, you aren't going to get to run a proper fast break every frikkin' play.  when the fast break slows, you run the game through Garnett.  it's a pretty simple plan.
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CraftyVet
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« Reply #13 on: May 15, 2007, 08:04:04 am »

I'm not going to look at the probability of this trade happening, I am just going to say that a trade like this would be an absolute blockbuster. From the Suns prospective, they lose one of the best young big men in the game today, all the while sacrificing their future for the opportunity to put together one of the greatest dynasties in recent memory.

The Timberwolves get an exciting young big man to start over with, so this deal is really a win win.
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bobcatsTRUTH
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« Reply #14 on: May 15, 2007, 10:12:35 am »

what about chemistry issues?  you're giving away the player with the best chemistry with nash in stoudemire...i'm going to guess that it would take at least a year for garnett to acclimate to the suns system, and then you would have to worry about either him or nash getting worn down and not being the players they have been (garnett, although young, has a LOT of nba mileage).
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