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Author Topic: Melo "Sounds Like He's Done in New York"  (Read 16189 times)
xduckshoex
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« Reply #255 on: April 30, 2014, 09:32:24 am »
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It's possible, but I personally don't know how likely they are to buy out Amare and Bargnani just I haven't heard much about them pursuing that. It seems like a big gamble to spend $35 million erasing players, possibly having Melo return or walk, and possibly hitting it big or striking out in free agency. Obviously, you have to take risks to make something happen, but a number of things have to fall right into place for them to get to the 2nd round and/or bring in income similar to that of the NBA record operating income.

Do they really miss out on anything by buying out Amare and Bargnani though? I don't see what the risk is.
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skywalker33
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« Reply #256 on: April 30, 2014, 10:09:11 am »
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Just to highlight how stupid all of this "there's nothing the Knicks can do" nonsense is, here is something very simple the Knicks can do: buy out Amare and Bargnani.  For most teams buying out $35 million in contracts is unthinkable but in the year the Knicks made the second round they set an NBA record for operating income and they passed the Lakers as the most valuable NBA franchise despite the Lakers record setting TV deal, so spending that money can be seen as a very smart investment.

That would leave them with around $29 million in cap space which gives them enough to sign Melo at the discount he advertised, bring in a couple more solid players for next season and still maintain cap space for one of the attractive free agents in 2015.

So how does buying these guys out affect the salary cap ?? I don't believe this it changes that restriction, it just changes the payout. Am I wrong about that ? The Knicks have always had the money, that's never been their problem, has it ?
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Death2SmallBall
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« Reply #257 on: April 30, 2014, 10:21:47 am »
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The whole thing is it'll depend on what type of discount melo takes, rough math has Knicks at around 33 mil after melo opt out, and roughly 30 to spend cap wise.  Melo gets his, the rest would be available to improve the team.

It's an intriguing possibility assuming ny got them deep pockets, crazy still is if they chose to stretch someone then go head and buyout/dump trade jr and Felton.
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Beetothezee
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« Reply #258 on: April 30, 2014, 10:27:50 am »
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So how does buying these guys out affect the salary cap ?? I don't believe this it changes that restriction, it just changes the payout. Am I wrong about that ? The Knicks have always had the money, that's never been their problem, has it ?

yo, your obsession with Melo and New York is super boring already. you talk more about Melo and New York than you do about your favorite team. the sooner you come to the reality that the ONLY good thing about Denver is the legality of marijana, the better off you will be
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madawg49
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« Reply #259 on: April 30, 2014, 10:37:44 am »
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So how does buying these guys out affect the salary cap ?? I don't believe this it changes that restriction, it just changes the payout. Am I wrong about that ? The Knicks have always had the money, that's never been their problem, has it ?


http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q66
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xduckshoex
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« Reply #260 on: April 30, 2014, 10:40:16 am »
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The whole thing is it'll depend on what type of discount melo takes, rough math has Knicks at around 33 mil after melo opt out, and roughly 30 to spend cap wise.  Melo gets his, the rest would be available to improve the team.

It's an intriguing possibility assuming ny got them deep pockets, crazy still is if they chose to stretch someone then go head and buyout/dump trade jr and Felton.

I think they still value Smith too much to use the stretch provision on him and I also think there aren't enough attractive free agents for it to be worthwhile unless Lebron or Bosh decide to jump ship for some reason. Probably better to give Smith another year to get it together and stretch him in 2015 if he doesn't.
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Death2SmallBall
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« Reply #261 on: April 30, 2014, 11:14:01 am »
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I think they still value Smith too much to use the stretch provision on him and I also think there aren't enough attractive free agents for it to be worthwhile unless Lebron or Bosh decide to jump ship for some reason. Probably better to give Smith another year to get it together and stretch him in 2015 if he doesn't.
smith could be an all star next season then out of the league the season after.  Lol. Not trusting this guy.
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Beetothezee
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« Reply #262 on: April 30, 2014, 11:25:46 am »
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i like what i saw from JR on and off the court for the last month of the regular season. he got carried away a few times but overall he played very well all around. i think with a new coach, new system (triangle,) he is ready to play on an all-star level next season. a lot of it is banking on Melo's decision. but i'm exited to see what he brings next season because i'm kinda routing for him
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skywalker33
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« Reply #263 on: April 30, 2014, 11:34:32 am »
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Thanks for the assist. According to the link, the salary stays with Knicks regardless of the buyout.

"67. How do buyouts affect team salary?
Any guaranteed salary still owed to the player as the result of a buyout continues to be included in team salary, just as with any waived player. "

So then tell me how these buyouts help the Knicks with next years salary cap or with the Melo situation other than freeing up money. They would still have to replace these positions on the roster anyway and now they'd just go further over the cap.
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madawg49
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« Reply #264 on: April 30, 2014, 11:37:23 am »
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Duck, wouldn't the amount of money the Knicks buy out Amare and Bargs for still count against the cap?  That wouldn't really give the Knicks any cap space after re-signing Melo.  Even if Amare and Bargs take significantly less than they are owed, and agree to have it stretched, it would not leave much cap space.  How much do you think the Knicks will have available? 
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skywalker33
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« Reply #265 on: April 30, 2014, 11:42:39 am »
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yo, your obsession with Melo and New York is super boring already. you talk more about Melo and New York than you do about your favorite team. the sooner you come to the reality that the ONLY good thing about Denver is the legality of marijana, the better off you will be

And every comment you make just shows your stupidity, but we all put up with it anyway.  This does happen to be a subject that can affect my favorite team since you still owe us draft positioning, i.e. there lies my interest, it's not about Melo or NY, just the Knicks propensity for their 2016 draft status.  

And seeing your stupid comment on Denver, I am betting you have never been to Colorado and seen all it has to offer, more likely your parole officer or your mother won't let you leave the state.
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xduckshoex
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« Reply #266 on: April 30, 2014, 12:28:03 pm »
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Thanks for the assist. According to the link, the salary stays with Knicks regardless of the buyout.

"67. How do buyouts affect team salary?
Any guaranteed salary still owed to the player as the result of a buyout continues to be included in team salary, just as with any waived player. "

So then tell me how these buyouts help the Knicks with next years salary cap or with the Melo situation other than freeing up money. They would still have to replace these positions on the roster anyway and now they'd just go further over the cap.

The contracts were signed before the 2011 CBA which means that the team and players can come to any payment schedule they want to and the cap hit would be adjusted to meet that payment schedule. They're governed by the 2005 CBA rules which had a stretch provision without any real restrictions.  You couldn't click on the "see question 65 for details" to find that out yourself?
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madawg49
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« Reply #267 on: April 30, 2014, 12:47:29 pm »
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The contracts were signed before the 2011 CBA which means that the team and players can come to any payment schedule they want to and the cap hit would be adjusted to meet that payment schedule. They're governed by the 2005 CBA rules which had a stretch provision without any real restrictions.  You couldn't click on the "see question 65 for details" to find that out yourself?

But Amare and Bargs have to play ball.  Can it be structured in any way?  "We'll give you $5.37 a season the next two seasons, and then $18 million in the 2016-17 season" or does it have to be evenly dispersed?  Say $15 million of the $23 million Amare is owed, $5 million a season for three seasons.
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Beetothezee
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« Reply #268 on: April 30, 2014, 02:43:54 pm »
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Quote
NEW YORK -- New York Knicks president Phil Jackson met with Carmelo Anthony on Tuesday night at a Manhattan restaurant to discuss the team's coaching situation and the star forward's pending free agency, according to a source with knowledge of the talks.

Anthony plans to opt out of the final year of his contract and test free agency this summer. Jackson has said that he'd like to re-sign Anthony but added recently that he'd prefer that Anthony take a pay cut to remain with the Knicks.

Carmelo Anthony, who is expected to become a free agent this offseason, met with Knicks president Phil Jackson at a steakhouse Tuesday night, according to a source.
Jackson is also conducting a search for the Knicks' next head coach, and TNT broadcaster Steve Kerr has emerged as a favorite. ESPN.com reported Tuesday that the Knicks are trying to complete a deal with Kerr that would install him as their new coach after the first round of the playoffs, according to sources with knowledge of the talks.

Jackson talked with Anthony about Kerr during their dinner meeting on Tuesday night at American Cut steakhouse in Manhattan, according to a source with knowledge of the meeting.

Photos of the meeting surfaced on the internet late Tuesday, and a source confirmed Wednesday that the meeting took place.

Jackson talked with Anthony about his relationship with Kerr and Kerr's background, the source said. Part of Anthony's decision in free agency will presumably be based on who is coaching the Knicks.

Anthony suggested in February that he would consider taking a pay cut to remain with the Knicks if it helped the team attract other free agents. Last week, Jackson said he hopes the All-Star forward is "true to his word."

Phil Jackson said he hopes Carmelo Anthony will take a pay cut to remain with the Knicks, allowing New York to pursue high-profile free agents.
It is unclear if that topic was broached at Tuesday's meeting.

"I think [there is] a precedent that's been set," Jackson said last week, referring to stars taking less money to join or remain with contending teams. "Because the way things have been structured now financially for teams is that it's really hard to have one or two top stars or max players, and to put together a team with enough talent, you've got to have people making sacrifices financially.

"So we hope that Carmelo is true to his word and we understand what it's going to take, and we will present that to him at that time."

Anthony can sign a maximum five-year, $129 million contract if he stays with the Knicks. He can sign a maximum four-year, $95.8 million with another team.

The Bulls, Rockets, Clippers and Lakers are expected to be among a group of teams that will show interest in Anthony this summer.

Last week, Jackson was asked if he would consider it a "disaster" if Anthony did not re-sign after all that the Knicks gave up to acquire him in 2011. New York traded four rotation players and two first-round picks to land Anthony in a blockbuster three-team trade.

"I'm all about moving forward," Jackson said. "Just deal with what is and move forward. If it's in the cards, man are we fortunate. If it's not in the cards, man are we fortunate. We're going forward anyway."


http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/10862972/phil-jackson-carmelo-anthony-meet-talk-new-york-knicks-coach-pending-free-agency
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skywalker33
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« Reply #269 on: April 30, 2014, 04:35:38 pm »
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The contracts were signed before the 2011 CBA which means that the team and players can come to any payment schedule they want to and the cap hit would be adjusted to meet that payment schedule. They're governed by the 2005 CBA rules which had a stretch provision without any real restrictions.  You couldn't click on the "see question 65 for details" to find that out yourself?

Wow, I was trying to be polite, guess you're back to your pompous self, I guess courtesy is not a NY thing. So I did read it and I can see if the player and the team agree to an arrangement of a buyout, the team can use the Stretch provision to reduce the cap over that time period. Not sure what type of "financing" a player would agree to, this option hasn't been used often as I know, most want a lump asap.  Also, both Bar's and Stat have only one more year, not sure they would want to take a discount on the final year of their contract...but anything is possible. It would allow for a large sum of money AND allow them to go looking for their NEXT contract, but do either really have a lot of options out there better than playing in NY ?
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