Home   Help Login Register  
Pages: [1] 2   Go Down
 
Author Topic: Knicks-Nets-Celtics  (Read 5174 times)
Oscar Rafone
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6561



« on: March 10, 2015, 06:24:54 pm »

Knicks trade: Calderon, Hardaway Jr. (or Shved), (fillers, if there is eventually someone that could interest Nets)
Knicks receive: Deron

Nets trade: Deron, Joe Johnson
Nets receive: Hardaway Jr. (or Shved), Turner, Sullinger, Calderon, G. Wallace, ( eventual fillers from Knicks)

Celtics trade: Turner, Sullinger, G.Wallace
Celtics receive: Joe Johnson

Why for Knicks: Given how the best FA in next summer are likely to not join Melo in NYK, they can think about their cap space to eat Deron contract, while giving away the bad Calderon contract, and fill the hole at PG

Why for Nets: They need to go in full rebuild role and this move would hugely speed up this whole process, by getting rid of their best players and heaviest contract at the same time. Get some spare asset in contract year to valorize and eventually flip for further asset too

Why for Celtics: Trade the expiring contract of a guy almost out of rotation + 2 guys that are unnecessary for their future and get back a big help for a playoff push on an expiring deal
Logged

There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics

A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man




Shawn Kemps Kids
Star
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2970


« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2015, 07:46:35 pm »

Stevens loves Sullinger and he is a part of their future, he is not being traded for JJ.
Logged
Oscar Rafone
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6561



« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2015, 09:08:55 am »

Stevens loves Sullinger and he is a part of their future, he is not being traded for JJ.
I'm not really sure about that. Ainge and Stevens harshly criticized Sullinger conditioning, telling that Sullinger hasn't always been a professional in this aspect and referring to excessive weight and lack of conditioning the numerous injuries and the inability to stay healthy, which is a big red flag on a guy which at the end of the season will have basically yet missed around 75 games in 3 seasons, and on parts of his body which are at risk of chronic injury like the back and the foot
Stevens love him, but he also praise professionalism, and Sullinger is not a good example of that, so he has probably cooled off on him
In addition to that, Sullinger can't play together with Olynyk, which is a guy on which Celtics spended their 1st round pick in 2013 draft because both aren't good defenders
In addition to that Boston has played good in his absence and have found guys that could represent good options as back-up PF/6th mans (which is Sullinger ceiling on a competitive team) like Jerebko or the same "old"  Bass, so Sullinger is becoming more and more expendable
Logged

There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics

A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man




Beetothezee
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6827


New York Knicks/Yankees/Jets


« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2015, 02:16:32 pm »

nonsense trade. why possibly would we want to clog our cap space with a maxed out PG that has declined and can't stay healthy when we can use the stretch provision to cut Calderon and add to our cap?
« Last Edit: March 11, 2015, 03:15:21 pm by Beetothezee » Logged


SIP madawg
Beetothezee
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6827


New York Knicks/Yankees/Jets


« Reply #4 on: March 11, 2015, 02:17:54 pm »


also, have you seen Shved play for us? he is a very nice option for next season at 4M. stop it
Logged


SIP madawg
Oscar Rafone
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6561



« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2015, 04:53:10 pm »

nonsense trade. why possibly would we want to clog our cap space with a maxed out PG that has declined and can't stay healthy when we can use the stretch provision to cut Calderon and add to our cap?
Who Knicks are going to pick up in next season FA with all that cap space, though? It looks that, among the top FA available, no one will leave their team for just tons of money (that their own team can match and even reraise) , they want a competitive team.
Here Knicks use the amount of money that they would give to a tier 2 FA to get rid of Calderon contract and upgrade a lot at PG, and trade Hardaway or Shved is to not let Knicks eat up too much cap space while absorbing Deron contract
Logged

There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics

A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man




Beetothezee
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6827


New York Knicks/Yankees/Jets


« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2015, 07:34:13 pm »

Who Knicks are going to pick up in next season FA with all that cap space, though? It looks that, among the top FA available, no one will leave their team for just tons of money (that their own team can match and even reraise) , they want a competitive team.
Here Knicks use the amount of money that they would give to a tier 2 FA to get rid of Calderon contract and upgrade a lot at PG, and trade Hardaway or Shved is to not let Knicks eat up too much cap space while absorbing Deron contract

again, cut the out. we won't waste money just to say we did. we will get guys and wait if we have to. we don't need a broke down declining max guard. besides, I'm positive much better things will come along outside of this foolishness
Logged


SIP madawg
sofakingbad
Starter
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1018



« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2015, 03:27:18 pm »

I just just stunned that you think a 3 team trade with all the teams in the same division would ever happen.
Logged

Beetothezee
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6827


New York Knicks/Yankees/Jets


« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2015, 07:41:30 pm »

I just just stunned that you think a 3 team trade with all the teams in the same division would ever happen.

this trade was ridiculous on so many levels. Shved alone can cancel out Williams at this point the way he has been playing at 4M next season. i wonder if Isaah Thomas gave him this idea? lol
Logged


SIP madawg
Oscar Rafone
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6561



« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2015, 05:00:08 am »

Sullinger is becoming more and more ependable now that Celtics are getting their streak upon very solid defense...
Logged

There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics

A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man




Beetothezee
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6827


New York Knicks/Yankees/Jets


« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2015, 06:07:37 am »

Sullinger is becoming more and more ependable now that Celtics are getting their streak upon very solid defense...

but how does this relate to your awful trade that gives us a broke down max player to clog our cap up? do you really think things are that bad that we can't use our money and even sign some 2nd tier players if everything else doesn't work? defend this trade because i thought you had more sense than this
Logged


SIP madawg
Oscar Rafone
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6561



« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2015, 07:45:23 am »

but how does this relate to your awful trade that gives us a broke down max player to clog our cap up? do you really think things are that bad that we can't use our money and even sign some 2nd tier players if everything else doesn't work? defend this trade because i thought you had more sense than this
Ehm, what you are NOT recognizing here is that you would effectively pay Deron as a 2nd tier player, and for 2 years so if things go bad you can flip him away and not being stuck with a bad contract for long time.
Depending on who you'll trade away between Shved and THJ, you would play him 11-13M next season, as you turn Calderon dead money in part of Deron contract, and you would only need to add a minimum contract guy to replace Shved/THJ role as bench players

Do you think that paying Deron as a 2nd tier player is such a bad move? Of course, you can say you can grab better 2nd tier players out there and you can dislike that for that reason, but given how weak is next FA market for truly available PG this kind of move could easily represent an option to take into consideration for NYK
Logged

There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics

A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man




Beetothezee
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6827


New York Knicks/Yankees/Jets


« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2015, 10:07:25 am »

Ehm, what you are NOT recognizing here is that you would effectively pay Deron as a 2nd tier player, and for 2 years so if things go bad you can flip him away and not being stuck with a bad contract for long time.
Depending on who you'll trade away between Shved and THJ, you would play him 11-13M next season, as you turn Calderon dead money in part of Deron contract, and you would only need to add a minimum contract guy to replace Shved/THJ role as bench players

Do you think that paying Deron as a 2nd tier player is such a bad move? Of course, you can say you can grab better 2nd tier players out there and you can dislike that for that reason, but given how weak is next FA market for truly available PG this kind of move could easily represent an option to take into consideration for NYK

nah, i don't think there is any scenario where it makes sense to take on Deron no matter how much the cap goes up. it would make more sense for us to stick with what we have and hold the cash for the season after next and try again than clog up our cap with a injury prone dealing player.

but with even the slight increase in the cap next season, we will get somebody. trades etc will appear that aren't even on the radar now. we'll be fine. its just a matter of time. matter of fact, we've got bigger fish to fry, a better scenario would be can we get a star for our pick?
Logged


SIP madawg
Oscar Rafone
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6561



« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2015, 12:08:53 pm »

nah, i don't think there is any scenario where it makes sense to take on Deron no matter how much the cap goes up. it would make more sense for us to stick with what we have and hold the cash for the season after next and try again than clog up our cap with a injury prone dealing player.

but with even the slight increase in the cap next season, we will get somebody. trades etc will appear that aren't even on the radar now. we'll be fine. its just a matter of time. matter of fact, we've got bigger fish to fry, a better scenario would be can we get a star for our pick?
Why are you switching the point now?
Knicks have no asset to use for a trade, other than their first round pick, of course. But it wasn't used their 1st round draft pick here
Here was proposed a trade when they get deron for asstes of no value + 11-13M of their cap space spent. What kind of guy they can realistically get in summer for 11-13 M max at PG position that can do a competent enough work as starter? Heck, to attract a taker for Calderon contract you would have probably needed to add assets to deal it away (assets that NYK does not have)

And clog up the cap? Deron has 2 year left on his contract, he doesn't clog up anything, Next season at most you can flip him away and use part of those money for another guy (and Calderon would use 7M of those cap space if you don't do the move, eh)

You think there are better option at PG for that price tag or lower or using assets of the same value that have been used here? Fine. I would be interested to listen them too
But to say that they could have a better scenario trading their 1st round pick for a star make no sense. Do this proposed Deron move does not inhibit them from doing what you were saying.
Logged

There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics

A noble spirit embiggens the smallest man




Beetothezee
MVP
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 6827


New York Knicks/Yankees/Jets


« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2015, 04:33:33 pm »

Why are you switching the point now?

i didn't "switch" the point, i built on your point. it happens lol


Quote
Knicks have no asset to use for a trade, other than their first round pick, of course. But it wasn't used their 1st round draft pick here

THJ, Galloway, Shved and even Calderon for that matter. it all depends


Quote
Here was proposed a trade when they get deron for asstes of no value + 11-13M of their cap space spent. What kind of guy they can realistically get in summer for 11-13 M max at PG position that can do a competent enough work as starter? Heck, to attract a taker for Calderon contract you would have probably needed to add assets to deal it away (assets that NYK does not have)

not necessarily, you can use the stretch provision on Calderon, that in itself is a bit valuable. Rondo doesn't look like much more than a 11-13M player at this point, and thats if even 11-13

Quote
And clog up the cap? Deron has 2 year left on his contract, he doesn't clog up anything, Next season at most you can flip him away and use part of those money for another guy (and Calderon would use 7M of those cap space if you don't do the move, eh)

when i say "clog" i mean waste the space with a so-so player at a high salary. thats the last thing we need coming off of a season like this

Quote
You think there are better option at PG for that price tag or lower or using assets of the same value that have been used here? Fine. I would be interested to listen them too
But to say that they could have a better scenario trading their 1st round pick for a star make no sense. Do this proposed Deron move does not inhibit them from doing what you were saying.

it is rumored we could move the pick, its all depending. too soon to know anything yet. even if it doesn't "inhibit" the move, it is a silly move. i'm not sure you comprehend the pressure that Phil is up to to improve this roster
Logged


SIP madawg
Pages: [1] 2   Go Up
 
 
Jump to: